Fone Forum

Hi All

Vonage announced 2.5p calls to Indian landlines and mobiles


A call plan specifically for those who call India a lot. We've slashed the cost of calling India using Vonage. You get unlimited‡ calls to UK landlines, of course. But with V-Plan India, calls to Indian landlines and mobiles are half-price — just 2.5p /min instead of the usual 5p /min rate with all our other call plans.


More details can be found here.

[Vonage don't want links from other sites like this. They believe it causes them problems]


Please note that Vonage is VOIP service that require a high speed broadband connection.

Hi panda, thanks for your announcement.   :)

I don't know too much about VoIP services, and probably there are other members here in the same boat.   :o

Please would you kindly explain to us something about it?  How do you go about choosing a VoIP provider, how do you join, and above all, how do you set it up on your PC or make calls from it?  You told us that we need fast broadband: how fast?  And what else is needed?  How do you connect a phone to your PC?   :-\

There are all sorts of things that VoIP users take for granted that others already know, but actually we don't.   :'(
Please will you kindly take pity on us, and explain all the basics?
   :-[

TIA.
   :)

VOIP works just like a traditional phone service. Just pick up your existing touch tone phone, no headset required, and make phone calls as you normally would - from your home phone to their home phone or mobile! VOIP uses your current broadband connection to make and receive calls but the people you call don't need either VOIP or broadband. And the great thing with VOIP is that your PC doesn't need to be switched on.

All the VOIP service provider supply VOIP gateway along with connection which connects to your modem or router. You can now connect ordinary phone to VOIP gateway and start making and receiving the calls.

I am using VOIP service from last one year and saving lot of money, as i had a cable broadband and only paying for broadband connection. VOIP service gave me normal UK Geo number.

I can travel with my Geo number in any part of the world, while making free calls to UK and other countries as per package and anyone can call me in the same way as they are calling to normal landline.

Good thing with vonage is that you can try them for one month and if you are not satisfied, they will refund you full money. Not only this, if i recommend my family and friends we get 3 months of free service.

Broadband connection ----> VOIP Gateway------> Ordinary Phone set------> make and receive calls

Comparing with normal phone service in UK, we have to pay about 10-11 pounds for line rental plus we have to pay extra for making calls with a limitation of 60 minutes of free call, whereas with VOIP no line rental, just have to pay less than 10 pound for making unlimited calls to UK and several Eu countries with free calling features such CLI, call forwarding, answering etc.

There are several VOIP services available in UK with different packages.


Broadband speed requirement:

Upload Speed
Upload speed play most important role in VOIP, it should be minimum of 200-250KB
You must have minimum speed of 200KB upload after your modem

Download Speed
200-250KB


Most of the VOIP service providers will inform you that only 50KB download speed is required, which is true but it does not give good quality of voice communication.

You have given a lot of helpful informatinn here panda, and I compliment you on your detailed reply.   :)

However I should like to ask 2 follow on questions myself.   :o

The first is: if you call from your landline rather than your PC, how come BT don't charge you for the call?

If the answer to my first question is that they use 0800 access numbers, where does this leave BT LUS customers who are not allowed to use alternative providers on their BT line, and for whom 0800 numbers to such services are blocked by BT?

I am well aware that LUS can't get broadband on their lines in the first place, but I am thinking of people subscribing from a public broadband service, say, and then wanting to place calls from their home 'phones.   ;)

Do you know if any of the VoIP services provide a silent trigger number to give callback to your line - so that no call needed to be made out from the BT line to make contact?   :-\

The answer to first question is that you are not connected either directly or indirectly to BT. You are connected to independent VOIP line which has no relation to to you PC or BT, simply the voice is travelling through IP.

0800 or no other access number is used to connect VOIP line.

It  work like traditional telephone without using copper or fiber optic wires.

Vonage will provide you an independent GEO number of your choice i.e London, Belfast or any other city number. I am living in Belfast and have 02890XXX number, i dn't have BT or virgin media telephone line.

For trial purpose if you can go to www.sipgate.co.uk which is free service, register you account and they will provide you free GEO number of you choice. Now configure Xlite software which is provided by them and try to call your sipgate Geo number, only in this case you are using PC to receive the calls, however for Vonage you will be connected by ordinary telephone set.

You have lost me somewhere in your first point about not being connected to BT.   :o :'(

If its a BT line how can it not be connected to them?   :'(

You are aware, are you not, that BT LUS customers cannot use any 4 or 5 figure prefixes to connect to other suppliers?   :-\

As this is the case, and even 0800 access to other suppliers is blocked, how do your VoIP supplier connect to your BT line?   :-\

I cannot grasp your answer yet I'm afraid.   :'(

You would need BT/Virgin line for broadband, to have VOIP.. Won't you ? then you are paying 2.5 p/min for India to Vonage, while you can get that for 1p/min via 0844 numbers on your BT line... I still don't understand the advantage of using VOIP for India.  Please correct me if I'm wrong or missing something here.

For 15 Min call to India via 0844= 7 p BT connection charges+ 15 p=  22p
Vonage = 37.5 p

(Am I right in my calculations ? Please excuse my ignorance about VOIP-  I've never used this service)

A phone line can carry both a telephone signal and a broadband connection, the latter coded digitally into a range of frequencies separate from the analogue voice channels.

When the broadband is connected to the exchange, digital signals can be sent to and from the IP address that represents the subscriber. Some will be email messages, some internet browsing of course. And as well VoIP, voice over IP, uses the broadband not the pstn phone. So there are no prefix codes, freephone access numbers, or whatever, and a VoIP call in progress does not make the ordinary landline busy.

The account can be running in a software client on a PC (sometimes temporarily installed from a USB stick, e.g. while travelling), or on hardware connected to the subscriber's router, the advantage of the latter being the account is still live while the PC is off. This hardware may be either a digital phone, or an analogue one connected via an analogue telephone adapter (ATA), or for the real afficionados an old PC running software called asterisk may be in there as well

2 users on the same VoIP provider would probably call each other with only the username, while calls are possible across providers using a common standard called SIP (except Skype, which has its own proprietary system), subject to peering agreements between them. The convention for defining the subscriber's VoIP account is sip:username@domain_name, which looks very similar to an email address, and it will be the provider's servers that resolve this to the IP address where it is actually logged in.

There may or may not be an incoming phone number (DID), for the extra convenience of receiving calls from pstn phones. If so, this is pointed by its provider at the SIP address, not the user's landline number. And in a suitably funded account, outgoing calls can be made to pstn.

Of course, you can see that a simple numbered handset would have difficulty entering letters of a SIP address, so numbered speed dials could be set up to do this. And a bit more elaborate: people might have accounts with more than one provider, and would have preferences for which to use for particular calls, and some providers would define numbers differently, so this is why the user would set up a dialplan.

The account does not have to be at the user's home address; it can be logged on anywhere in the world. So you could take an ATA and a telephone and plug it into a router or hub in Germany or Australia, and someone could phone your UK local number to reach you there. Or if you receive tons of calls from a certain country, for the convenience of your callers you might be able to rent an incoming number there and divert it to your VoIP account.

Some of these VoIP providers have extra services, for example that the account can be used via callthrough access numbers, convenient from a mobile, or there may be callback available with a range of trigger options. There are some which have virtual pbx systems which are user-configurable, but then it all starts to get complicated ...

It seems that only Telesavers offer Indian landlines and mobiles for 1p Ash, but yes you are right in principle I believe.  ;)

You don't need any telephone line for connecting to virgin broadband.

for above case you are connected through 0844.. where as in this case you connecting India directly, no connection charges at all

Simple answer to you question is that you are not connected to BT,

you are only connected to VOIP through broadband, supplied from any source, Cable broadband, DSL, or HSPDA broadband.

You will have independent Geo number

Your calls will go out directly using broadband connection.

simple equation

Broadband modem or router -----> Voip Gateway---> Telephone Set------Make or receive calls

I don't see BT line in above equation

It has been very frustrating not being able to participate in discussion on this thread for several days, as the quality of information given has been very high.  However, I have travelled today to a library in an adjoining county, and I am glad to say that I have no connection, navigation, or posting problems here.

I should like to give my personal thanks to both panda and andy for all that they have shared here.        :)

The only problem that I can see is that replies to mobileman and HiPD do not appear to address the particular situation that they outlined.        :o

mobileman specifically said that BT LUS customers
 

He also said:


This was reiterated by HiPD in his reply #5.

As I am a BT LUS customer myself, I happen to know the problems to which both referred.  BT will NOT allow you to have ANY broadband on your line until after you have come off the LUS scheme - either their own, or anyone else's.

In view of this, comments about using your "existing touch tone phone", your "not being connected to BT", or even andy's statement that

is simply not true of BT LUS customers AFAIK.        ???

The only way that a BT LUS customer can place a call over a rival network, in my experience, is if he can obtain a callback arrangement of some sort.  mobileman actually directed attention to this in his final sentence in reply #4.  andy very nearly picked up on this point, as he mentioned
but unfortunately he stopped there, and did not mention suitable services at which to look.       :'(

None of this detracts from the very useful things that have come out in this discussion, but if the particular circumstances of BT LUS customers is going to be addressed, there has to me more said about callback service side I believe.

Could either of you say more about this side of VoIP provider services kindly ?

Thanks for MH for joining our topic.

VOIP service is always dependent on broadband, and always cost effective if you are not paying line rental to telephone company.

If you connected to Broadband without telephone line, for example cable broadband, you will be saving line rental for phone service.

I am not aware that BT LUS does not allow you to have broadband service, in this case you can't get VOIP service.

Simple requirement for VOIP service is:

Fast Broadband Connection
VOIP gateway
Telephone set.

Once you have VOIP phone service you can get:

UK or some EU Countaries GEO number
You may get additional line on same VOIP gateway.

Features of VOIP are

no Line rental
Only package charges

999 / 112
Voicemail Plus
Caller Display
Call Waiting
1471
Ring Back
International Call Barring
Call Diversion
Call Transfer
Call Hunt
Anonymous Call Block
Do Not Disturb
Ring Lists
Withhold Caller Display
3-Way Calling
VOIP to VOIP free Calls
Online Account
Free Features
Click-2-Call

Some VOIP service provider give all the above features free of cost with their package.

What is VOIP

VOIP or Voice over Internet Protocol is the technology that allows digitized audio to be transmitted over Intranets and the Internet. Broadband telephone service is a revolutionary new digital voice service that leverages VOIP to combine the power of your phone and your high-speed Internet connection.

For the consumer, broadband telephone service is an inexpensive alternative to traditional telephone communication over the Public Switched Telephone Network (PSTN).  VOIP covers computer-to-computer, computer-to-telephone, and telephone-based communications.

Benifit of VOIP Service

Broadband telephony is useful because it provides all the basic functionality of conventional telephony plus additional features - all at a much lower cost. 

One very useful feature that is unique to VOIP (Voice over Internet Protocol), is the ability to acquire and use phone numbers in other cities, states and even distant countries.  This allows people in that area to make local calls to you, and for you to make local calls to them.  This effectively eliminates long distance calls that you otherwise would pay.

Another unique feature of broadband telephony is the ability to take your phone number with you wherever you go:  to a country cottage, on a business trip to Europe or Africa, or even when you move permanently to a different location.  With conventional phone numbers, it is often impossible to retain a phone number even if you are moving just a few blocks away.

Broadband telephones and VOIP technology (Voice over Internet Protocol) are useful to many different groups including consumers, teenagers, small businesses, large companies and people on the move.

Who requires VOIP Service

Consumers
Consumers can enjoy monthly residential local phone rates that are half the cost of conventional telephone service.  Because long distance phone calls travel over the Internet rather than over the telephone network, long distance calls are also much less expensive.  If the consumer has family and friends in another city, the person can further benefit by obtaining a second phone number in that city rather than in the city in where they live. This eliminates long distance charges for calls between the two cities.

Teenagers
Rather than paying for a second land-line phone for a teenager or for expensive cell phone service, a broadband telephone service can be a great alternative.  Not only is it a less expensive option, the individual can take the number wherever he/she goes, provided that there is high-speed Internet connection to plug into at that location.

Large and Small Businesses
Businesses that wish to expand into new markets in other cities, states or countries, can establish a virtual presence in the target area by providing telephone support using a local phone number.

Similarly, if a firms suppliers are physically located elsewhere (e.g. India, China, Malaysia), communications with the suppliers can be enhanced and costs reduced by acquiring and using a local phone number in the city where the suppliers operate. 

People on the Move
The portability of a broadband telephone services allows you to take your local phone number with you wherever you go.  If your job involves travel or if you want to spend the winter months in a sun drenched paradise, yet remain active in your business, a broadband telephone service should be considered.

Where VOIP is availible

In essence, broadband telephone service is available anywhere that high-speed Internet connectivity is available.  In most towns and cities, inexpensive high-speed Internet connectivity is readily available via cable TV and ADSL service providers. In remote locations, high-speed Internet connectivity is available via satellite.  VOIP (Voice over Internet Protocol) technology can therefore be leveraged anywhere.

Unfortunately, broadband telephone service providers are not yet operating in many regions.  It is therefore not possible to obtain telephone numbers in all communities and in all countries.  Consequently, you would have no problem obtaining a local Los Angeles, Toronto or London phone number wherever you live.  You could, however, have difficulty finding a Broadband telephone service provider who could give you a local phone number in Lagos, Nigeria.  

Nonetheless, if you ever visited Lagos and had access to a high-speed Internet connection, you could still use your broadband telephone service to make free "local" phone calls to friends, family and business associates back home.

How does VOIP Work

There are three types of VOIP (Voice over Internet Protocol) phone services available: 

Web-to-Web
Web-to-Phone
Phone-to-Phone
Web-to-Web VOIP Service
Web-to-web phone service has been available for a number or years.  It requires that the person making the call and the person receiving the call have VOIP software installed on their computers.  They both must be connected to the Internet and be expecting the call.  Due to these inherent limitations, web-to-web phone service has not gained much popularity.

Web-to-Phone VOIP Service
Web-to-phone telephone service requires that the person making the call have VOIP software installed on their computer.  The service can be used to make inexpensive outgoing long distance telephone calls, however, calls can't be received from conventional phones.

Phone-to-Phone VOIP Service
Phone-to-phone service is the emerging technology that offers the most promise.  It requires that one party have a telephone adapter device that plugs into their high-speed Internet connection or router.  A conventional phone is plugged into this adapter.  Phone-to-phone VOIP service supports both incoming and outgoing calls.  The cost of both local and long distance telephone service is much less than it would be using a conventional land-line telephone service or cell phone service.

Where to Start for VOIP

If you wish to try broadband telephone service, this is what you should do:

Determine which of the three types of VOIP telephone service you require. (web-to-web, web-to-phone, phone-to-phone).
 
 If you decide that you need web-to-web or web-to-phone service, select a service provider, download their software, establish an account and make your first call.
 
If "phone-to-phone" service is what you require, you should first decide where you would like to have your phone number based (i.e. country and area code). 
 
Identify VOIP service providers that can provide a telephone number in the desired city, state or country.  Our database of service providers will help you with this.
 
Visit the websites of candidate VOIP service provider and compare their offerings and service costs. 
 
Subscribe to the broadband telephone service of your choice and obtain the necessary phone adapter device by mail or at a local store.
 
Plug the telephone device into the router (i.e. firewall) that is connected to your Internet modem.  If you dont have a router, you can purchase one at any computer store for approximately 25 pounds.
 
Plug a standard household cordless or corded telephone into the Internet telephone adapter device.
 
Make your first phone call over the Internet.

Source: http://broadband-telephones.com/guide/definition.aspx

Possible sources for this information are suggested by andy in reply #16.  panda is free to attribute his sources himself, as andy has asked.        ;)

Thanks panda.  I guessed that you hadn't grasped the specifics of the situation mm outlined.       ;)

This does not detract from the quality and value of your own contributions, or those of andy.       :)

I still believe that VoIP services may be used over BT LUS lines - on two provisos.

The first is that the VoIP account is set up over the internet away from home.
The second is that your VoIP provider offers some callback facility.

Possibilities for this include a silent call to trigger the callback, a webstite request ( accessed via WAP ), or a text message.  ( andy may add a java client to this list, but I have no experience of these ).

Any further information about VoIP callback arrangements would be most welcome - from any member.

Thanks again.

This is trully quality information, and this thread is quickly becoming my current favourite!
Many thanks panda.   :)

I hope that all other Moderators, and indeed members, will want to emulate this high stanrdard.

Regards.

Dave.

Maybe, but I think not; instead perhaps some education in etiquette is needed.

It's conventional, indeed usually a requirement if permission is asked, to attribute other people's original material using a small quote and a name or a link, rather than a huge copy-and-paste, especially when this is asserted

Copyright ©. All rights reserved

http://www.broadband-123.co.uk/broadband_services/broadband_phone.html

http://broadband-telephones.com/guide/availability.aspx

http://broadband-telephones.com/guide/architecture.aspx

http://broadband-telephones.com/guide/subscribing.aspx

Thank you for making your concerns known andy.  Perhaps panda might like to edit his post to make his sources clear.       ;)

However, even if this should have been attributed, that does not detract from the value of the information contained in the article, which was appreciated by Dave and others.

Let's learn from the principles of etiquette to which you have referred, without 'throwing out the baby with the bath water'.

I am not aware of any VOIP service provider which have the callback service. May be Andy can explain it.

Vonage provides Click to call service, which is a small software which can be installed on your computer, once we enter the required number, it Dials the number a and callback on your VOIP phone.

Panda

andy doesn's seem to have responded to your suggestion
panda.  Please will you do so andy.