Unlocked iPhones

[mobaholic]

Dear New Starter and others,

Thanks for your replies. Yesterday when I contacted O2 customer services they informed me that unlimited data and wi-fi is  not applicable on PAYG iphone. I thought it wasn't correct, I have to go to an O2 store and check with them.

I will check into this further tomorrow when I hope to have full internet access, but I suspect that this dispute may be a semantic quibble.       

As far as I know, the O2 Pay & Go iPhone has never been free data and WiFi actually - that has always been subject to a £10 monthly topup.       

If I find that I am mistaken, or that things have changed recently, I will make a further post then.

[petkow]

How I read it is this:

Each iPhone for Pay & Go includes 12 months unlimited data and Wi-Fi access *

and from the terms and conditions:

*Unlimited data and Wi-Fi
Data usage whilst roaming not included. Unlimited Wi-Fi is available at any of the 9,500 Wi-Fi hotspots from our partners The Cloud and BT Openzone. Excessive usage policy and full terms apply. At the end of the twelve month free period you will start to be charged £10 per month for the Unlimited Web and Wi-Fi Bolt On.

So how I read that is that you get 12 months free data regardless on how much you top it up etc. and then you pay £10 per month (again regardless on how much you top it up by) to keep getting the same level of service for unlimited data useage. You can obviously opt out at that stage.

[petkow]

There are a few further terms to do with not taking out the SIM which came with the phone, and not using it in another device to avail of this offer. But apart from this, there is no mention of minimum topups required etc.

The page to look at is: http://shop.o2.co.uk/tariffSmallPrint#WebWifi and scroll down to the next section.

[mobaholic]

I agree with you 100% about their written T&Cs petkow - in fact I argued exactly that point in an O2 shop 6 to 8 months ago.  Unfortunately, their staff tell me that's not how it happens in practice.         

The argument goes that the pay & go tariff is an addition to, say, the home postcode p&g tariff - which requires a £10 topup monthly.
I was assured that if I bought a pay & go iPhone, I would get the free data and WiFi ONLY in the months I topped up.

There is no dispute about what the words are tailored to convey - just about what happens in practice.

The former appears to be to lure customers in: the latter to extract cash from them.       

( The difference in the second and following years is that the £10 topup is deducted for the data and WiFi, rather than being a prerequisite for it, but left on the account to be spent as you like. )       

[petkow]

How poor of them! They need to really brush op on these T's and C's a lot more to make them clearer to customers. Even when we (who might have a higher ability than most customers) to go through them with a fine toothcomb, cannot completely understand what they mean to convey. I suppose they can stand on the fact that there is no specific mention that a monthly topup is not required, and so as it is not mentioned, it doesn't mean that that is the case after all.

This is another good example of a very poor general attitude of theirs that I struggle to understand at times. I had a lengthy argument with them several years ago about a mute point like this, where I had been charged for incoming calls to my voicemail whilst roaming, even though I was paying for a service (MyEurope Extra) that specifically was intended to remove this charge as clearly mentioned in their T's and C's (or so I thought). In those days the site said something as watertight as: "Total charge for incoming call to Voicemail: 0 p/min". However, after a lengthy discussion with them after I had got charged 25p/min when people had left messages (and I had not even listened to them later), was that though the incoming call is not charged, an incoming call on my number automatically generates a sequential outgoing call to my voicemail box which is charged. 

To cut a very long story short, I did finally get my way, got a lot of money refunded and they did change their T's and C's after my conversation... 

[mobaholic]

Well I 'take my hat off' to you for your persistence and triumph petkow: well done.       

But my motive for 'battling' about such issue is to ensure that members are not enticed by their apparent T&Cs - as I was so nearly myself.       

Hope you understand.

[petkow]

I understand. It's worth making the warning!

[srikanth.nuli]

Dear Members,

If I wish to purchase a pay as you go Apple iphone 3GS 32GB handset from O2 store, or elsewhere would I be able to receive any cashback? I apologise to others for asking a similar type of query because I haven't understood how does these cashback websites work even though I had a detailed look at them.

I'd be glad if someone can provide more information.

Thank you

Regards,
Srikanth.

[NewStarter]

Dear Members,

If I wish to purchase a pay as you go Apple iphone 3GS 32GB handset from O2 store, or elsewhere would I be able to receive any cashback? I apologise to others for asking a similar type of query because I haven't understood how does these cashback websites work even though I had a detailed look at them.

I'd be glad if someone can provide more information.

Thank you

Regards,
Srikanth.

O2 has just 3.50 pounds cashback on o2 PAYG. but still it stands as the best deal on iphone.
On how cashback sites work.. its simple.. visit the relailer link from the cashback sites and shop as you do normally. they will track and update the earned cashback.

-NS

[mobaholic]

O2 has just 3.50 pounds cashback on o2 PAYG. but still it stands as the best deal on iphone.
On how cashback sites work.. its simple.. visit the relailer link from the cashback sites and shop as you do normally. they will track and update the earned cashback.

-NS

Your answer is helpful as far as it goes NS.  Thank you.         

But my reading suggests there is a little more to it.       

Cookies are the problem !         

What happens, lots of time, is that people look at offers first, to decide what suits them.  Understandable enough.  But what they don't realize is that each website they visit puts a cookie on their PC.  Then when they go to their chosen cashback website, navigate to their chosen site, and make their purchase, many are unhappy when the seller refuses to pay their cashback to quidco or whomever - on the grounds that it is not clear through whom they placed their order.       

The ONLY safe way to buy through cashback sites, I am told, is to delete all your browser cookies immediately before going to them to go on to the website from which you make your purchase.         

This is especially important when purchasing any mobile from the '3' shop.       

[nixforfun]

Dear Members,

If I wish to purchase a pay as you go Apple iphone 3GS 32GB handset from O2 store, or elsewhere would I be able to receive any cashback? I apologise to others for asking a similar type of query because I haven't understood how does these cashback websites work even though I had a detailed look at them.

I'd be glad if someone can provide more information.

Thank you

Regards,
Srikanth.

Your best deal to buy iPhone would be to buy from Apple Store online through Quidco. Apple gives 4% cashback which would fetch you around 28 pounds (they give you cashback on pre-VAT rate). You can buy one on O2 and they would be happy to unlock it with 15 quids credit deducted from your account & loss of web & wifi offer.

MH- My personal experience says that O2 are very clear on the topping up policy for iPhone sim. You need to topup just once & you will get free web & wifi for 12 months without need to top it up ever. When I was in the UK, I got an iPhone 3GS and I topped up once to get the web & wifi offer. Infact the free wifi is tied in to the MAC of your iphone so you dont actually require to use your PAYG sim in iPhone. I got my free wifi activated, put in the O2 simplicity SIM i was using & when the Openzone login page asked me my number- I put in the PAYG number and I could use wifi for free for months. There is no way for Openzone to verify your mobile number since you dont make a call to it which may allow it to read your CLI.

The only thing O2 were strict in was not to use the O2 PAYG sim to access 3G/2G data on another handset & they would send you warning messages if you did so. In my case, I just put that sim aside without use. Yes I did lock in 10 pounds and the free 2g/3G web portion but was OK.

Regards
Nik

[mobaholic]

MH- My personal experience says that O2 are very clear on the topping up policy for iPhone sim. You need to topup just once & you will get free web & wifi for 12 months without need to top it up ever. When I was in the UK, I got an iPhone 3GS and I topped up once to get the web & wifi offer. Infact the free wifi is tied in to the MAC of your iphone so you dont actually require to use your PAYG sim in iPhone. I got my free wifi activated, put in the O2 simplicity SIM i was using & when the Openzone login page asked me my number- I put in the PAYG number and I could use wifi for free for months. There is no way for Openzone to verify your mobile number since you dont make a call to it which may allow it to read your CLI.

The only thing O2 were strict in was not to use the O2 PAYG sim to access 3G/2G data on another handset & they would send you warning messages if you did so. In my case, I just put that sim aside without use. Yes I did lock in 10 pounds and the free 2g/3G web portion but was OK.

Regards
Nik

Thanks for your fascinating contribution Nik.       

I can understand the wifi working, without the iPhone SIM, if it is tied to your iPhone MAC as you say, but to use the free internet would surely require the correct SIM, wouldn't it ?       

AFAIK all data use is SIM and tariff dependent, so I believe it is still the case that a monthly £10 topup is required to get your monthly free internet and wifi allowance.       

Of course if you are happy with wifi only your scheme would work - BUT that is a very expensive way of getting free wifi !       

If that is all that you require, a O2 pay & go dongle is available for ~ £20, and you could use wifi on your laptop - without the need to buy an expensive iPhone costing some £449 or £549 !             

[nixforfun]

I can understand the wifi working, without the iPhone SIM, if it is tied to your iPhone MAC as you say, but to use the free internet would surely require the correct SIM, wouldn't it ?       

AFAIK all data use is SIM and tariff dependent, so I believe it is still the case that a monthly £10 topup is required to get your monthly free internet and wifi allowance.       

Of course if you are happy with wifi only your scheme would work - BUT that is a very expensive way of getting free wifi !       

If that is all that you require, a O2 pay & go dongle is available for ~ £20, and you could use wifi on your laptop - without the need to buy an expensive iPhone costing some £449 or £549 !             

MH, unless things have changed in recent past, even web works without need to topup monthly. You just need to top it up once. I used free web for 5 months without recharging (after which I left UK). Infact the iPhone SIMs are available in plenty on ebay if you want to use free web on any other handset till O2 finds out and disconnects your free web.

Also, you cannot use the wifi which came with a iPhone SIM on your dongle. By recognising iPhone MAC ranges or some other identifier (browser user agent?), BT Openzone login page automatically redirects you to iPhone version where you put only your O2 mobile number and register. Once registration is made, you can use wifi anytime on any Openzone hotspot without registering again. (although at times a reset was required). I tried this a bit, there is no way to use the iPhone's free wifi on laptop sadly (not even with tethering)

[NewStarter]

Your answer is helpful as far as it goes NS.  Thank you.         

But my reading suggests there is a little more to it.       

Cookies are the problem !         

What happens, lots of time, is that people look at offers first, to decide what suits them.  Understandable enough.  But what they don't realize is that each website they visit puts a cookie on their PC.  Then when they go to their chosen cashback website, navigate to their chosen site, and make their purchase, many are unhappy when the seller refuses to pay their cashback to quidco or whomever - on the grounds that it is not clear through whom they placed their order.       

The ONLY safe way to buy through cashback sites, I am told, is to delete all your browser cookies immediately before going to them to go on to the website from which you make your purchase.         

This is especially important when purchasing any mobile from the '3' shop.       

I have to agree with you on this MH . Though I have never read about this, seeing the way cashback sites work, I always browse for the product I need and then clear all the cookies and then buy it via cashback site. I didn't know if that is the standard everyone followed

[mobaholic]

MH, unless things have changed in recent past, even web works without need to topup monthly. You just need to top it up once. I used free web for 5 months without recharging (after which I left UK). Infact the iPhone SIMs are available in plenty on ebay if you want to use free web on any other handset till O2 finds out and disconnects your free web.

Also, you cannot use the wifi which came with a iPhone SIM on your dongle. By recognising iPhone MAC ranges or some other identifier (browser user agent?), BT Openzone login page automatically redirects you to iPhone version where you put only your O2 mobile number and register. Once registration is made, you can use wifi anytime on any Openzone hotspot without registering again. (although at times a reset was required). I tried this a bit, there is no way to use the iPhone's free wifi on laptop sadly (not even with tethering)

Thanks for your further reply Nik.       

On your first point, all that I have posted is what has been explained to me in the local O2 shop.  They put it like this:-

Let's say your iPhone is on the Favourite Place tariff.  You get 500 free minutes to landlines and O2 numbers - but only if you topup by £10.
Well it's exactly the same with free wifi and internet.  It IS free - but conditional on your topping up - just as the 500 free minutes are !

Now if that information is wrong, it is good to have a correction.  But are you sure you weren't just lucky, or their system had a glitch in your case ?       

On your second point, I was never suggesting using your iPhone SIM in a dongle.  I was just pointing out that it made no sense to pay out £449 or £549 for an iPhone - if all you want is free wifi.  That is available for free with O2's pay & go dongle, so who needs an iPhone for that ?       

I think that buying an iPhone for free wifi only is stark raving bonkers !